[Dysphagia] Re: Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 36

[Tammy.Gadbois at med.va.gov (Gadbois, Tammy C.)]

I believe they are among the documents that are "sealed" and Greer will not
unseal them for the DCF lawsuit.  But here is something that might send some
light on the subject.  Greer did not allow testimony in court from Terri's
friend from the age of 2 on, based on the supposition Terri was only 14 when
the statement was made in 1977 re: the Karen Ann Quinlin case.  If you
haven't heard yet, Terri's statement was "Where there is life, there is
hope" and she was VERY upset with her friend for making an off-color comment
re: Quinlin.  However, Terri's friend has said there conversation was not in
1977 when Terri was 14, but rather in 1982.  Terri would have been 19, not
14. 

Here's the article: 

1. Schindlers Were Outgunned by Lawyers Early

In case you were wondering, with so many facts in dispute about the Terri
Schiavo case, the answer is relatively clear: The Schindlers,
well-intentioned as they have been, were outgunned in the early legal fight
that sealed their daughter's fate.

The early legal maneuvering created "facts" that are now beyond dispute in
higher courts. One is the unbelievable claim by Michael Schiavo that Terri
wanted to be starved and dehydrated to death.

One Florida attorney told the story on Steve Sailer's Web blog
(www.isteve.com).

Here's what the lawyer wrote:

"I have been following the case for years. Something that interests me about
the Terri Schiavo case, and that doesn't seem to have gotten much media
attention: The whole case rests on the fact that the Schindlers (Terri's
parents) were totally outlawyered by the husband (Michael Schiavo) at the
trial court level.

"This happened because, in addition to getting a $750K judgment for Terri's
medical care, Michael Schiavo individually got a $300K award of damages for
loss of consortium, which gave him the money to hire a top-notch lawyer to
represent him on the right-to-die claim. He hired George Felos, who
specializes in this area and litigated one of the landmark right-to-die
cases in Florida in the early '90s.

"By contrast, the Schindlers had trouble even finding a lawyer who would
take their case since there was no money in it. Finally they found an
inexperienced lawyer who agreed to take it partly out of sympathy for them,
but she had almost no resources to work with and no experience in this area
of the law. She didn't even depose Michael Schiavo's siblings, who were key
witnesses at the trial that decided whether Terri would have wanted to be
kept alive. Not surprisingly, Felos steamrollered her.

"The parents obviously had no idea what they were up against until it was
too late. It was only after the trial that they started going around to
religious and right-to-life groups to tell their story. These organizations
were very supportive, but by that point their options were already limited
because the trial judge had entered a judgment finding that Terri Schiavo
would not have wanted to live.

"This fact is of crucial importance -- and it's one often not fully
appreciated by the media, who like to focus on the drama of cases going to
the big, powerful appeals courts: Once a trial court enters a judgment into
the record, that judgment's findings become THE FACTS of the case, and can
only be overturned if the fact finder (in this case, the judge) acted
capriciously (i.e., reached a conclusion that had essentially no basis in
fact).

"In this case, the trial judge simply chose to believe Michael Schiavo's
version of the facts over the Schindlers'. Since there was evidence to
support his conclusion (in the form of testimony from Michael Schiavo's
siblings), it became nearly impossible for the Schindlers to overturn it.
The judges who considered the case after the trial-level proceeding could
make decisions only on narrow questions of law. They had no room to ask,
"Hey, wait a minute, would she really want to die?" That "fact" had already
been decided.

"In essence, the finding that Terri Schiavo would want to die came down to
the subjective opinion of one overworked trial judge who was confronted by a
very sharp, experienced right-to-die attorney on one side and a young,
quasi-pro bono lawyer on the other.

"Nothing unusual about this, of course. It's the kind of thing that happens
all the time. But it's an interesting point to keep in mind when you read
that the Schiavo case has been litigated for years and has been reviewed by
dozens of judges ... yadda yadda yadda.

"By the way, I'm guessing that George Felos is probably quite happy to work
the Schiavo case for free at this point since it's making him one of the
most famous right-to-kill -- I mean right-to-die -- lawyers in the country.
His BlackBerry has probably melted down by now, what with all the messages
from the hurry-up-and-die adult children you've been blogging about."









-----Original Message-----
From: dysphagia-bounces@b9.com [mailto:dysphagia-bounces@b9.com] On Behalf
Of Anne Merhar
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 5:21 PM
To: dysphagia@b9.com
Subject: [Dysphagia] Re: Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 36


With all due respect to the efforts in maintaining www.Terrisfight.net, I
would like to know where the site is that archives the documents
instrumental in Judge Greer's decisions.  
 


dysphagia-request@b9.com wrote:
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Today's Topics:

1. Re: Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 35 (Ralph and Patti)
2. Re: Hausted vs Vess for VFSS (Woodford Beach)
3. RE: Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri Sc hiavo?
(Tammy.Gadbois@med.va.gov)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 14:44:37 -0500
From: "Ralph and Patti" 
Subject: [Dysphagia] Re: Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 35
To: 
Message-ID: <008601c53305$695eca00$e7eb0541@2risq>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Well, I would not presume to have a take on the Schiavo case, but I do
remember that one SLP sent a message to this listserve about her involvement
in the case. Why would anyone make a statement that the waters had been
"muddied" by an SLP??? We are the very ones who should have some input,
albeit spitting in the wind. Two years ago I had the very same confrontation
with a patient who's family made her funeral arrangements. Her tube was
pulled (by the patient herself) and the family knew she would die. Guess
what, she lived for 2 years, fed herself and died with dignity.I am proud to
have been instrumental in her ability to live out her life with some modicum
of "I have the right to be who I am." This issue is so global--we all must
make a statement about how we want our lives to end. Terri Schiavo is a
microcosm of the great big picture. Having said that, thanks for listening.
Patti
----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 2:00 PM
Subject: Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 35


> Send Dysphagia mailing list submissions to
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> http://lists.b9.com/mailman/listinfo/dysphagia
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>
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> than "Re: Contents of Dysphagia digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. RE: Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri Schiavo? 
> (Connors, William A.)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 17:30:39 -0500
> From: "Connors, William A."
> Subject: RE: [Dysphagia] Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with
> Terri Schiavo?
> To: "Denise Stoltzfus" ,
> , 
> Message-ID:
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I believe that a SLP muddied the waters by suggesting Terry could 
> recover.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dysphagia-bounces@b9.com [mailto:dysphagia-bounces@b9.com]On 
> Behalf
Of Denise Stoltzfus
> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:18 PM
> To: asha-div13@lists.asha.org; dysphagia@b9.com
> Subject: [Dysphagia] Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri
Schiavo?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Carol
> To: SID3VOICE for Karnell
> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:10 PM
> Subject: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri Schiavo?
>
>
> Dear List,
>
> This is a heartbreaking situation, with strong feelings on both sides.
>
> Was there a Speech & Language Pathologist who ever worked with Terri 
> Schiavo? If yes, was any progress ever made?
>
> At least one nurse who worked with Terri for a year, said that Terri 
> was originally able to verbalize and communicate in an understandable 
> way, by saying a few words, and by indicating when she had pain, 
> menses, etc.
>
> If there once was speech therapy given to Terri, why was the speech 
> therapy stopped?
>
> Since some patients' very lives depend on their ability to "say" what 
> THEY want, to independent observers, I think this is a relevant 
> question--not only for Terri, but for others, where there is 
> disagreement about a handicapped/diabled person's intention, and where 
> there is no living will.
>
> Sincerely,
> Carol Sidofsky (retired nurse/RN, former VCD patient) 970-726-4440
> http://cantbreathesuspectvcd.com
>
>
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> End of Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 35
> *****************************************




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 16:07:59 -0500
From: "Woodford Beach" 
Subject: Re: [Dysphagia] Hausted vs Vess for VFSS
To: , ,

Message-ID: <000001c53392$a3b1afa0$ee493e0a@vcuhs.mcvhvcu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

We also just got the Transmotion Chair (actually Radiology bought it after
we sent them some info about it without telling us). It so far has been
wonderful.

Woodford A. Beach, Ph.D., CCC/SP

----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: ; 
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 12:29 PM
Subject: RE: [Dysphagia] Hausted vs Vess for VFSS


> We purchased the TransMotion Medical chair. It's got a very wide seat
with
> a narrow back. Can lay flat for transfer. And can swivel on it's wheels
so
> you can turn it from A/P to lateral very quickly.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dysphagia-bounces@b9.com [mailto:dysphagia-bounces@b9.com] On Behalf
> Of Powers, Heather M.
> Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 8:43 AM
> To: 'dysphagia@b9.com '
> Subject: [Dysphagia] Hausted vs Vess for VFSS
>
>
> Hi! I am new to this list, so I apologize if this has recently been
> discussed. I work at a large Trauma I acute care hospital and we are in
the
> process of replacing our Hausted chair. We are trying to decide between
> another Hausted or the VESS chair. We have some concerns about the VESS
> meeting the needs of all of our patients, such as those with halo's,
> positioning issues, etc. I've researched the archives and it seems as if
the
> Hausted was more recommended. Is this still the case - I don't know if the
> chairs have changed that much in the last five or so years. Any input from
> those of you using either chair in acute care would be greatly
appreciated.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Heather Powers, MA, CCC-SLP
> University of Tennessee Medical Center
> _______________________________________________
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>



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:10:08 -0600
From: Tammy.Gadbois@med.va.gov
Subject: RE: [Dysphagia] Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with
Terri Sc hiavo?
To: denisestoltzfus@hotmail.com, asha-div13@lists.asha.org,
dysphagia@b9.com
Message-ID: <66E773076AB6414F8E67341E4E4F54CF567F5C@VHATOMEXC1>
Content-Type: text/plain

Michael had all therapy stopped once he won the lawsuit. They got through a
loophole in the judge's decision to halt all therapy by having someone (not
an SLP) try to do some therapy over the phone, but once Michael found out
about it, this was halted as well by Michael. 

All this and other testimony and affidavits not allowed in court by Judge
Greer are at 
www.terrisfight.org 

My question is what did they base the NPO recommendation on? Is this the
same recommendation the profession would make today, given the information
Irene has given us and the fact that over 5 people have fed Terri various
foods/beverages over the years, which she has successfully swallowed and she
has no problem handling her own secretions?????

-----Original Message-----
From: dysphagia-bounces@b9.com [mailto:dysphagia-bounces@b9.com] On Behalf
Of Denise Stoltzfus
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 12:18 PM
To: asha-div13@lists.asha.org; dysphagia@b9.com
Subject: [Dysphagia] Fw: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri Schiavo?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: Carol 
To: SID3VOICE for Karnell 
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:10 PM
Subject: Was there a SLP who once worked with Terri Schiavo?


Dear List,

This is a heartbreaking situation, with strong feelings on both sides.

Was there a Speech & Language Pathologist who ever worked with Terri
Schiavo? If yes, was any progress ever made?

At least one nurse who worked with Terri for a year, said that Terri was
originally able to verbalize and communicate in an understandable way, by
saying a few words, and by indicating when she had pain, menses, etc.

If there once was speech therapy given to Terri, why was the speech therapy
stopped?

Since some patients' very lives depend on their ability to "say" what THEY
want, to independent observers, I think this is a relevant question--not
only for Terri, but for others, where there is disagreement about a
handicapped/diabled person's intention, and where there is no living will.

Sincerely, 
Carol Sidofsky (retired nurse/RN, former VCD patient) 970-726-4440
http://cantbreathesuspectvcd.com


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End of Dysphagia Digest, Vol 16, Issue 36
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